backsidetailsli
Sep 17, 11:50 AM
Blink 182 - Blink 182
First Pressing Pink/Green Swirl 1/500
Lazer Etched D side
2xLP
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs306.ash2/58645_1404469115663_1350420078_984677_1402047_n.jpg
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs629.snc4/58937_1404468995660_1350420078_984676_322619_n.jpg
First Pressing Pink/Green Swirl 1/500
Lazer Etched D side
2xLP
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs306.ash2/58645_1404469115663_1350420078_984677_1402047_n.jpg
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs629.snc4/58937_1404468995660_1350420078_984676_322619_n.jpg
dba7dba
Apr 13, 02:35 PM
This. I can see manufacturers adopting Airplay or eventually adopting something more sophisticated like actual software from apple to mimic that of the Apple TV
you mean something like Samsung apps?
http://thenextweb.com/gadgets/2011/01/17/samsung-tv-apps-surpass-2-million-downloads/
you mean something like Samsung apps?
http://thenextweb.com/gadgets/2011/01/17/samsung-tv-apps-surpass-2-million-downloads/
Bern
Jul 25, 01:50 AM
At last, I've been waiting for this since the Mighty Mouse was announced. I still don't understand why Apple didn't release a BT version in the first place. Maybe a WWDC announcement??
wovel
Apr 13, 07:44 PM
Oh, this rumor, again (like the 4th time?)... :eek:
:rolleyes:
I am not sure why it won't die. I suppose they might, I just can not think of any reason why. The Apple TV as a STB is a much better fit for them. Might they sell this to tv makes as an embedded option. Maybe. Will they make their own TV, I still don't see the point.
:rolleyes:
I am not sure why it won't die. I suppose they might, I just can not think of any reason why. The Apple TV as a STB is a much better fit for them. Might they sell this to tv makes as an embedded option. Maybe. Will they make their own TV, I still don't see the point.
more...
Onigiri
Sep 12, 08:04 PM
Those look really slick, how do you like them so far?
I love them! I've met the couple that makes them and they're all done by hand. Very sturdy and obviously, very beautiful. They look great on a shelf and feel even better in my hand.
I love them! I've met the couple that makes them and they're all done by hand. Very sturdy and obviously, very beautiful. They look great on a shelf and feel even better in my hand.
MacinDoc
Apr 13, 06:35 PM
what are they gonna call it? Apple tv?
rofl
rofl
more...
MagnusVonMagnum
Nov 18, 04:38 PM
Hopefully, the websites that provide their videos through a legacy Flash wrapper will soon be providing their users with a choice.
I am elated that iOS Safari has no Flash support. I do not want the CPU suck, the identity suck, the unpredictable behavior, and the exposure to Adobe bugs. If you want those things, feel free to get an Android device.
It would be better if Apple provided its users with a choice of whether they want to enable a flash plugin or not in their devices instead of screwing us all over by making so many web sites unusable (although I'm sure the author of Skyfire is thrilled about that choice since it's making him rich beyond his wildest dreams all because Apple is run by an egomaniac).
I am elated that iOS Safari has no Flash support. I do not want the CPU suck, the identity suck, the unpredictable behavior, and the exposure to Adobe bugs. If you want those things, feel free to get an Android device.
It would be better if Apple provided its users with a choice of whether they want to enable a flash plugin or not in their devices instead of screwing us all over by making so many web sites unusable (although I'm sure the author of Skyfire is thrilled about that choice since it's making him rich beyond his wildest dreams all because Apple is run by an egomaniac).
MacSA
Jul 24, 05:24 PM
I dont know what people see in the Mighty Mouse, I tried one out in a local computer shop and found it VERY frustrating to use.
more...
Tipsy
Apr 13, 09:10 AM
well done.
it is macrumors, after all.I enjoy idle speculation about this stuff as much as the next guy but I still think the old 'everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts' thing should probably be adhered to (and I hope that doesn't come across as snarky to the original poster, and apologies to him/her for [citation needed]ing if it turns out I was wrong).
Widgets and personalization - not needed. Only nerd losers stare at their OS, being unable to find any better way to spend their pathetic empty life with no purpose.Waiting for you to change the tone when Apple comes out with widgets and custom personalization.You sound like I am against it.Can we take that as an admission that you're a nerd loser who is unable to find any better way to spend his pathetic empty life with no purpose? :D
If you are, don't worry, we all post here too...
I couldn't quite tell if your post was serious given how you followed up on it, but I think having better notifications and making better use of the home screen might be quite high priorities from a user-experience point of view. Wouldn't it be helpful to see a Gmail-style snippet of your new emails visible when you unlock your phone? Or possibly a small calendar display so you can see at a glance that there's a meeting you're booked into later? I guess it might be difficult to integrate these things without dramatically reducing the space visible for apps but I can imagine a lot of people having a use for this kind of functionality and Apple is denying people the choice at the moment.
I still don't quite understand why people are so averse to the idea of a visible file system, as though this means you're going to have to poke around in a directory structure to find a note in Notes, or a song in the iPod or somesuch. It's adding functionality for those who want to use it, not complicating things for people who don't want to use that side of things. I'm sure Apple has the engineering talent to do it.
it is macrumors, after all.I enjoy idle speculation about this stuff as much as the next guy but I still think the old 'everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts' thing should probably be adhered to (and I hope that doesn't come across as snarky to the original poster, and apologies to him/her for [citation needed]ing if it turns out I was wrong).
Widgets and personalization - not needed. Only nerd losers stare at their OS, being unable to find any better way to spend their pathetic empty life with no purpose.Waiting for you to change the tone when Apple comes out with widgets and custom personalization.You sound like I am against it.Can we take that as an admission that you're a nerd loser who is unable to find any better way to spend his pathetic empty life with no purpose? :D
If you are, don't worry, we all post here too...
I couldn't quite tell if your post was serious given how you followed up on it, but I think having better notifications and making better use of the home screen might be quite high priorities from a user-experience point of view. Wouldn't it be helpful to see a Gmail-style snippet of your new emails visible when you unlock your phone? Or possibly a small calendar display so you can see at a glance that there's a meeting you're booked into later? I guess it might be difficult to integrate these things without dramatically reducing the space visible for apps but I can imagine a lot of people having a use for this kind of functionality and Apple is denying people the choice at the moment.
I still don't quite understand why people are so averse to the idea of a visible file system, as though this means you're going to have to poke around in a directory structure to find a note in Notes, or a song in the iPod or somesuch. It's adding functionality for those who want to use it, not complicating things for people who don't want to use that side of things. I'm sure Apple has the engineering talent to do it.
bloodycape
Jul 12, 02:16 PM
1. HELLO, the current ones are old already, they are bound to have better batteries. Its been a year. a year ago that was the best apple could do. Its not the best anymore.
2. If this is a VIDEO IPOD... 2hrs-3hrs of battery life for videos, sure as hell wont cut it. the current ipod makes video as more of a cool feature as opposed to MAIN feature. music was most important.
I see what you are saying however there were PMP's that came out the same time as the 5G iPod that gets 5 hours out of video from a removable battery with a 4in screen. When the iPod color came it had the same battery life as the monochrome ipod. So if history is a good indication of the past then the next ipod will have similar specs out of a larger screen machine? But I could be wrong.
I think for Apple to be competitive in the pmp market against the best currently out now they need to do a few thing. The main thing this is have a player that gets 5 hours or more of video with 25hours of audio. Then they need to have video recording if they want to compete with the likes of the Cowon A2, and Archos AV500 series. And then there is the open source Digital Cube V43 with its touch screen and linux/unix based.
2. If this is a VIDEO IPOD... 2hrs-3hrs of battery life for videos, sure as hell wont cut it. the current ipod makes video as more of a cool feature as opposed to MAIN feature. music was most important.
I see what you are saying however there were PMP's that came out the same time as the 5G iPod that gets 5 hours out of video from a removable battery with a 4in screen. When the iPod color came it had the same battery life as the monochrome ipod. So if history is a good indication of the past then the next ipod will have similar specs out of a larger screen machine? But I could be wrong.
I think for Apple to be competitive in the pmp market against the best currently out now they need to do a few thing. The main thing this is have a player that gets 5 hours or more of video with 25hours of audio. Then they need to have video recording if they want to compete with the likes of the Cowon A2, and Archos AV500 series. And then there is the open source Digital Cube V43 with its touch screen and linux/unix based.
more...
irmongoose
Jul 11, 07:05 PM
WE HAVE COMPETITION!! Thank you, at last... :sniff:
This is war.
irmongoose
This is war.
irmongoose
Prof.
Sep 17, 03:55 PM
Telling myself it's an "Educational Purchase" makes me feel better about spending so much money lol.:D
http://grab.by/6rkO
http://grab.by/6rkO
more...
jessica.
Jan 26, 10:49 AM
Haha, I don't care, but it would have been nice to keep it going since I did the last 2 and put some work in tracking down old threads and adding up posts etc etc. Whatever.
Really? So even after I PM you and apologize for stepping on toes that I did not know were there you're still going to give me crap? I don't get it. Now, on the note of tracking down old threads, I will add them since it is apparently SOP to have them there. I will likely do it in a while though, I hope that is acceptable to you.
What I truly love is when I take the time to apologize for creating a thread, which is absurd, then that very person continues to brow beat me over the content, format, and apparent creation. If using your logic then you creating the last two stepped on the toes of the one who created the one just before yours. Again, this seems absurd and quite childish.
If this is going to ruin your day then please PM me and ask me to have a mod delete this thread to leave it open for you to create a new one. I don't gain anything by creating a new thread, I just saw the other exceeded 2k posts. Again, this was as innocent as I could possibly get and yet I'm still being **** on by people who apparently have issues with me.
Really? So even after I PM you and apologize for stepping on toes that I did not know were there you're still going to give me crap? I don't get it. Now, on the note of tracking down old threads, I will add them since it is apparently SOP to have them there. I will likely do it in a while though, I hope that is acceptable to you.
What I truly love is when I take the time to apologize for creating a thread, which is absurd, then that very person continues to brow beat me over the content, format, and apparent creation. If using your logic then you creating the last two stepped on the toes of the one who created the one just before yours. Again, this seems absurd and quite childish.
If this is going to ruin your day then please PM me and ask me to have a mod delete this thread to leave it open for you to create a new one. I don't gain anything by creating a new thread, I just saw the other exceeded 2k posts. Again, this was as innocent as I could possibly get and yet I'm still being **** on by people who apparently have issues with me.
twoodcc
Nov 29, 08:28 PM
I have my fingers crossed! one of them is connected to the power supply for another machine :eek: it seems to be working for now but I will have to get some bigger psu's soon. The one you are getting looks like a good deal.
oh ok. yeah i've heard of people doing that though. yeah, better get a bigger psu soon though
oh ok. yeah i've heard of people doing that though. yeah, better get a bigger psu soon though
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notabadname
Apr 28, 11:06 AM
So the iPhone went from being pummeled by Android to now just being badly beaten.
That is Awesome.
Ha, ha . . . As if I should be embarrassed about losing a bar fight against 20 people.
Name any single Android phone model that has out-sold the iPhone 4.
That is Awesome.
Ha, ha . . . As if I should be embarrassed about losing a bar fight against 20 people.
Name any single Android phone model that has out-sold the iPhone 4.
AidenShaw
Apr 26, 02:50 PM
12Mbps? you sure you didn't mean 1.5GBs?
Thanks for pointing out the typo - I meant 12 Gbps.
(original fixed)
Thanks for pointing out the typo - I meant 12 Gbps.
(original fixed)
more...
balamw
Oct 23, 08:29 AM
Did you read any of the thread so far?
You can use Vista Home standalone in a virtualization environment legally.
This is purely a misinterpretation of the EULA.
Dave,
I understand where you are coming from, but I still don't interpret the EULA as you do. Neither does Paul Thurrott http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/winvista_licensing.asp. Can you please provide links to others who think like you, preferably if they happen to work for MS. ;)
The earlier thread on this topic is here: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=243716
B
You can use Vista Home standalone in a virtualization environment legally.
This is purely a misinterpretation of the EULA.
Dave,
I understand where you are coming from, but I still don't interpret the EULA as you do. Neither does Paul Thurrott http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/winvista_licensing.asp. Can you please provide links to others who think like you, preferably if they happen to work for MS. ;)
The earlier thread on this topic is here: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=243716
B
simX
Oct 18, 06:22 PM
Yes, thank you. At least someone else out there is emotionally distanced enough from the iPod and the Apple entertainment sector to be a bit objective.
Innovation: just what happened to Apple's innovative spirit when it comes to computers? The latest Mac Pro was fitted into the existing (and way oversized) G5 case. The MacBook was disappointing in that - proportionally - Apple did not shrink it at all or make it lighter than its predecessor (a design which had been in existence for about four years). There are more things, but I really don't want to sound like a troll here...
Apple needs to come out with new computer models that are unlike anything else out there. What about a tiny, thin ultraportable? What about a smaller tower, so those of us that want a pro computer don't have to invest in an oversized monster (which is larger than any PCs in the market that I am aware of). Aren't computers supposed to get SMALLER as the technology advances? Why is Apple obsessed with making the iPod smaller and smaller, but does not care as much about its laptops and desktops?
The answer: profit, or course. The iPod is Apple's cash cow. And this, my friends, is what I mean when I say that Apple needs to be partitioning off a little of its innovative energy that it is putting into its entertainment sector and bring it back to the computer line.
Understood now?
OK, now fire away :)
*sigh* How many times do we have to refute your assertions with facts before you stop repeating them?
To wit, the iPod is not Apple's "cash cow". By definition, if there is something that gains more revenue/profit than the iPod, then the iPod cannot be the cash cow. 58% of Apple's revenue still came from sales of Macs. Gross margins for both Macs and iPods has always been similar (hovering a bit below 30%), so the Mac also generates the majority of the profit for Apple.
As for Apple's innovative spirit lacking when it comes to the Macs, let's just point out that it Apple updated the iPod in October 2005 to the 5th generation, and we JUST got the 5.5th generation last month. Apple took a year to add slightly brighter screens, better battery life (only for video), and games. The nano just gained the anodized aluminum exterior -- wow, Apple's reaching back to the past for it's innovation now! And the shuffle got slimmed down and consolidated into one product. All this doesn't sound exactly like innovation to me. (Of course, Apple doesn't really need to innovate, since they're already selling iPods by the boatload.)
In contrast, Apple brought all of its Macs over to the Intel processor. The Mac Pro was dramatically higher value, what with double-wide graphics card slot, dual optical drives, 4 internal hard drive bays, etc., etc. All Macs (except for the Mac Pro) now have Front Row and a remote, which is a great feature. Built-in iSights have also migrated across the entire product line. The MacBook and MacBook Pro now have MagSafe -- a great innovation. Boot Camp is now supported on all new Macs. The Xserve has new features like lights-out management, redundant power supplies, etc. And we've seen some great things coming for Leopard, what with Time Machine and Spaces and iChat Theater and Core Animation and iCal Server, etc., etc., etc.
It seems to me that Apple is innovating more on the Macintosh side of things than they are with the iPod. What are they going to add next on the iPod -- wireless? *gasp*, so innovative!
Seriously, can we stop with this myth already? It's the same thing with all of Apple's "woes" with quality control (which was busted by the recent consumer reports articles where Apple has actually brought DOWN the number of new computers needing repair in their first year). It's something that's repeated ad nauseum by a few vocal people, when it's really not a problem at all. Same here: everybody gawks and writes about the iPod precisely because more people can afford it and more people can use it with whatever computer they have. So, obviously, you will hear more about the iPod.
Let's see if repeating myself again has any effect: the iPod is not Apple's cash cow!
Understood now?
OK, now fire away :rolleyes:
Innovation: just what happened to Apple's innovative spirit when it comes to computers? The latest Mac Pro was fitted into the existing (and way oversized) G5 case. The MacBook was disappointing in that - proportionally - Apple did not shrink it at all or make it lighter than its predecessor (a design which had been in existence for about four years). There are more things, but I really don't want to sound like a troll here...
Apple needs to come out with new computer models that are unlike anything else out there. What about a tiny, thin ultraportable? What about a smaller tower, so those of us that want a pro computer don't have to invest in an oversized monster (which is larger than any PCs in the market that I am aware of). Aren't computers supposed to get SMALLER as the technology advances? Why is Apple obsessed with making the iPod smaller and smaller, but does not care as much about its laptops and desktops?
The answer: profit, or course. The iPod is Apple's cash cow. And this, my friends, is what I mean when I say that Apple needs to be partitioning off a little of its innovative energy that it is putting into its entertainment sector and bring it back to the computer line.
Understood now?
OK, now fire away :)
*sigh* How many times do we have to refute your assertions with facts before you stop repeating them?
To wit, the iPod is not Apple's "cash cow". By definition, if there is something that gains more revenue/profit than the iPod, then the iPod cannot be the cash cow. 58% of Apple's revenue still came from sales of Macs. Gross margins for both Macs and iPods has always been similar (hovering a bit below 30%), so the Mac also generates the majority of the profit for Apple.
As for Apple's innovative spirit lacking when it comes to the Macs, let's just point out that it Apple updated the iPod in October 2005 to the 5th generation, and we JUST got the 5.5th generation last month. Apple took a year to add slightly brighter screens, better battery life (only for video), and games. The nano just gained the anodized aluminum exterior -- wow, Apple's reaching back to the past for it's innovation now! And the shuffle got slimmed down and consolidated into one product. All this doesn't sound exactly like innovation to me. (Of course, Apple doesn't really need to innovate, since they're already selling iPods by the boatload.)
In contrast, Apple brought all of its Macs over to the Intel processor. The Mac Pro was dramatically higher value, what with double-wide graphics card slot, dual optical drives, 4 internal hard drive bays, etc., etc. All Macs (except for the Mac Pro) now have Front Row and a remote, which is a great feature. Built-in iSights have also migrated across the entire product line. The MacBook and MacBook Pro now have MagSafe -- a great innovation. Boot Camp is now supported on all new Macs. The Xserve has new features like lights-out management, redundant power supplies, etc. And we've seen some great things coming for Leopard, what with Time Machine and Spaces and iChat Theater and Core Animation and iCal Server, etc., etc., etc.
It seems to me that Apple is innovating more on the Macintosh side of things than they are with the iPod. What are they going to add next on the iPod -- wireless? *gasp*, so innovative!
Seriously, can we stop with this myth already? It's the same thing with all of Apple's "woes" with quality control (which was busted by the recent consumer reports articles where Apple has actually brought DOWN the number of new computers needing repair in their first year). It's something that's repeated ad nauseum by a few vocal people, when it's really not a problem at all. Same here: everybody gawks and writes about the iPod precisely because more people can afford it and more people can use it with whatever computer they have. So, obviously, you will hear more about the iPod.
Let's see if repeating myself again has any effect: the iPod is not Apple's cash cow!
Understood now?
OK, now fire away :rolleyes:
KnightWRX
Dec 31, 07:48 AM
ok, I'm sorry but how the hell do you know what I do or don't understand about nutrition?? your presumptions are offensive
And yours about me weren't ? Look, I made my presumptions based on some facts you posted :
- Too busy to work out (which isn't an issue for weight control)
- Having to lose weight (Doctor's orders)
- Thinking Yoga is an effective weight control.
- No mention of food.
I made a presumption that you don't understand the basic premise of weight control. I hope my post at least opened up your eyes and you can go from there to learn what works for you, with your busy schedule, instead of thinking a busy schedule is a reason to stay the way you are.
This is her choice. It effects her and her family, not you. I forgot how God declared that fat people go straight to hell, because being fat is so evil...
It's her choice up to a point. There's nothing wrong with 20 lbs overweight, give or take a few. Doctors will always tell you to be in the "zone" (healthy weight with a BMI between 18-25) but mostly there isn't much harm until later in life. Just like there's nothing wrong with taking fast food in reasonable quantities, or smoking if done occasionally.
However, what she is doing is not just affecting her and her family. Morbid obesity affects all of society, be it through requiring services reserved for the disabled (she's not really disabled, she just chooses to be). The problem, like in all things bad for you (fast food, alcohol, smoking, drugs, whatever) is not occasional use, it's abuse. This woman has an abusive food consumption. Your examples are wrong because they try to equate what she is doing with what people are doing within reason. Your list should have been more :
- Alcoholics should be able to stay that way! There's nothing wrong with 2 glasses of gin to wake up
- 3 packs a day of smokes is perfectly fine!
- Gambling all your money away and then borrowing some to gamble more is a person's choice!
- You can never have enough Crystal Meth.
The fact is, these are abusive tendencies which stem from deeper problems or addictions.
BTW, I run about 5 km, 5 days a week. I ski (doing mostly Park, so climbing uphill on foot dragging my equipment), I do weight lifting too. I think I can sit and post on Macrumors a few times :D
And yours about me weren't ? Look, I made my presumptions based on some facts you posted :
- Too busy to work out (which isn't an issue for weight control)
- Having to lose weight (Doctor's orders)
- Thinking Yoga is an effective weight control.
- No mention of food.
I made a presumption that you don't understand the basic premise of weight control. I hope my post at least opened up your eyes and you can go from there to learn what works for you, with your busy schedule, instead of thinking a busy schedule is a reason to stay the way you are.
This is her choice. It effects her and her family, not you. I forgot how God declared that fat people go straight to hell, because being fat is so evil...
It's her choice up to a point. There's nothing wrong with 20 lbs overweight, give or take a few. Doctors will always tell you to be in the "zone" (healthy weight with a BMI between 18-25) but mostly there isn't much harm until later in life. Just like there's nothing wrong with taking fast food in reasonable quantities, or smoking if done occasionally.
However, what she is doing is not just affecting her and her family. Morbid obesity affects all of society, be it through requiring services reserved for the disabled (she's not really disabled, she just chooses to be). The problem, like in all things bad for you (fast food, alcohol, smoking, drugs, whatever) is not occasional use, it's abuse. This woman has an abusive food consumption. Your examples are wrong because they try to equate what she is doing with what people are doing within reason. Your list should have been more :
- Alcoholics should be able to stay that way! There's nothing wrong with 2 glasses of gin to wake up
- 3 packs a day of smokes is perfectly fine!
- Gambling all your money away and then borrowing some to gamble more is a person's choice!
- You can never have enough Crystal Meth.
The fact is, these are abusive tendencies which stem from deeper problems or addictions.
BTW, I run about 5 km, 5 days a week. I ski (doing mostly Park, so climbing uphill on foot dragging my equipment), I do weight lifting too. I think I can sit and post on Macrumors a few times :D
AppleScruff1
Apr 28, 11:14 AM
How do you "win" a platform war?
Does Google win because they have so many devices running their Android OS? *Marketshare*
Or does Apple win because you have to buy their hardware in order to get iOS? *Profit*
Or can we just agree that both platforms are doing insanely well in their respective ways?
Agreeing on that would be too logical. :D
Does Google win because they have so many devices running their Android OS? *Marketshare*
Or does Apple win because you have to buy their hardware in order to get iOS? *Profit*
Or can we just agree that both platforms are doing insanely well in their respective ways?
Agreeing on that would be too logical. :D
SeanMcg
Nov 3, 11:34 AM
It will be interesting to see changes the parallels will make. competition is nice. unless you are microsoft...
..who won't let you legally (http://download.microsoft.com/documents/useterms/Windows%20Vista_Ultimate_English_9d10381d-6fa8-47c7-83b0-c53f722371fa.pdf) install a "Home" version of Vista in a virtual enviroment, forcing you to pay more for the Ultimate version.
..who won't let you legally (http://download.microsoft.com/documents/useterms/Windows%20Vista_Ultimate_English_9d10381d-6fa8-47c7-83b0-c53f722371fa.pdf) install a "Home" version of Vista in a virtual enviroment, forcing you to pay more for the Ultimate version.
hotrock3
Apr 14, 12:21 PM
BGR seems to be getting pretty good at this. I wonder how they made such an accurate connection inside Apple....
yoak
Jul 24, 04:52 PM
I have BT keyboard and mouse with my iMac and I love the tidyness of it. One cable that�s all. I have tried the MM in the shop and I thought it was nice to use, but from what I�ve read here it seems to be problems with the scroll ball. Guess my old mouse will do for now
Blakjack
Apr 22, 05:30 PM
That dewing would mean the phone be top heavy and be more pruned to falling the hand.
When holding our phones, a lot of times, the top half hangs over. With thinner bottom, we could easily drop.
That's my opinion.
When holding our phones, a lot of times, the top half hangs over. With thinner bottom, we could easily drop.
That's my opinion.
